potential problem with the new 'flag in' rule !

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garyinderry

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Out for 9 this afternoon and obviously didn't take the flag out every time I had a putt and wondered how this new rule will work. On many of the holes the flag lay away from me providing a backstop for my putt.

This is especially handy on those pesky 3 footers. I felt I could hit them that but harder with the flag in and leaning away.

Will the new rule lead to everyone trying to take advantage of this? will it lead to more time wasted?

If its within the rules and I feel I have a benefit from it, I will most likely end up asking for the flag to be put in if I feel it will lie leaning away from me.

Fast downhillers I would probably leave it in too from any distance.

I can see this being abused in a big way once everyone catches on. You hear of 'using the rules to your advantage.' this is one that will be massively abused jmo.


I'd personally not bother changing this rule. It was fine the way it is. I feel this could get messy. You could have the flag being put in and out multiple times while one four ball is all on the green. Crazy.


Thoughts?
 

Hosel Fade

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How are you going "to feel" it will lie away from you? Look at the plug and socket with a magnifying glass and then instruct someone to put it in just so? Or just intentionally replace it with a lean yourself?
 

Coffey

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Its a very interesting point. Had a quick google and found this:

http://www.golf.com/instruction/flag-or-out

It does seem that the flag provides a backstop and would help people putting. I think you could see everyone just leaving it in, don't see much point of taking it out anymore. I guess some people will still like it in, but if it does aid you, why would you remove it?
 

IanG

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I agree and have thought the same. They could have a rule that once the flag is out it stays out but that would get messy if players off the green are closer that someone on the green etc. Best leave it as it is it doesn't really cost time too often compared to many other things.

I'd like to see a rule at least for stroke play that once you started putting you continued to putt until you holed out. Also that you can only mark and clean the ball once on each green.
 

patricks148

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isn't there a consultation period before this (all the new amendments ) come in ??

this will prob be ironed out once it s becomes a rule.

I'm drawn in a comp tomorrow with an R&A Rules official. I will ask him and report back
 
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garyinderry

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Its quite obvious how a flag leans. Very rarely straight up and down. Thick heavy poles you find at posh clubs stand straighter.

Most you find at normal clubs lean in a certain direction.

Currently if i am just off the green i will decide to leave it in if it helps or take it out if will get in the way. This is just the issue that can and imo will arise all the time when people putt from different directions on the green.
 
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I'd like to see a rule at least for stroke play that once you started putting you continued to putt until you holed out. Also that you can only mark and clean the ball once on each green.
Treading on everyone else's line in the process?
 

IanG

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Treading on everyone else's line in the process?
yep - how often does someone standing on your line really make any difference. Even now they may have walked across what is now your line 30 sec before you putted.

I think the uber politeness about this we have now is misplaced. Maybe I haven't played on boggy enough greens in mid-winter.
 

Alex1975

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If this comes in you wont need to put the flag back in as it will already be in. 100% people will take advantage, you would be a fool not to.
 

Orikoru

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yep - how often does someone standing on your line really make any difference. Even now they may have walked across what is now your line 30 sec before you putted.

I think the uber politeness about this we have now is misplaced. Maybe I haven't played on boggy enough greens in mid-winter.
I wonder about this as well. And golf shoes have changed a lot over the years too - I sometimes wonder if the not standing on people's lines thing was more relevant when golf shoes all had proper spikes on them. As you say, it's probably more important in winter than in summer, where the green will be pretty firm with or without someone stepping on it.
 
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garyinderry

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isn't there a consultation period before this (all the new amendments ) come in ??

this will prob be ironed out once it s becomes a rule.

I'm drawn in a comp tomorrow with an R&A Rules official. I will ask him and report back
Please do.

Imagine the rule is in place tomorrow. How often would you benefit from the flag going back in if it is initially lieing away from you.



Also practice a few short ones and see how easy they are with a backstop. We could potentially see the flag going back in the closer people get to the hole. This is not going to save time in the slightest.

Tell Mr. R and A i said, 'its a no from me'. :)
 

Hosel Fade

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I wonder about this as well. And golf shoes have changed a lot over the years too - I sometimes wonder if the not standing on people's lines thing was more relevant when golf shoes all had proper spikes on them. As you say, it's probably more important in winter than in summer, where the green will be pretty firm with or without someone stepping on it.
You must have never seen someone with Adizeros play on remotely receptive greens
 

Imurg

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When I play solo I leave the flag in and use it as a target for most putts.
I try to hit the ball hard enough to touch the flag before dropping.
You can hit quite a firm putt, and therefore remove much of the break, from 3-4 feet if you hit the pin
 

Fish

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Can this be adopted now in comps?

I rarely have the flag in, I putt much better with it out from any distance, especially on sunny days with shadows at angles off the flag or anyone attending it.

If I can see the hole the flags out for me, but, we do have some very big sloping greens which if your above them are very scary, could be an option 🤔
 

clubchamp98

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Can this be adopted now in comps?

I rarely have the flag in, I putt much better with it out from any distance, especially on sunny days with shadows at angles off the flag or anyone attending it.

If I can see the hole the flags out for me, but, we do have some very big sloping greens which if your above them are very scary, could be an option 樂
sure the USPGA did a trial years ago and said more shots stay out if they hit the flag.
Thats why most pros have the flag out when chipping.
Didnt do from 3 ft though as this rule was not out then.
I think it will cause more problems than it solves.
 
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garyinderry

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Ive played enough golf to know i benifit from a flag slightly titling away.

One that it straight up and down i might remove for a makeable chip.


Like IMURG, when i play solo and putt out, i dont always remove the flag for tap ins, i feel that flag stick can help in a lot of situations.


Yesterday was just the first time i gave the new potential rule change much thought. How would it work? How could peoples attitudes to the flag in or out change.

I came to the conclusion, under the proposed new rule, i may well become a torturous player to play with on the green always looking to benifit from how the flag rests.

I can also forsee arguments in matches where players accuse one another of not replacing the flag as it was.

The whole thing could get really really stupid.

Id love to explain my thoughts to Patrick's R and A man. I hope he gets my concerns across to him.
 
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