Blm-Renaming the masters

C&R

Assistant Pro
Joined
Jul 8, 2012
Messages
219
This whole thread is pretty eye opening and after reading all the comments thus far here my opinion -

Rename it back to its original name. I believe it was quoted earlier as "The Augusta National Invitational". Sounds like the perfect name for a major to me. The club clearly has a strong racist past, statues have been ripped up across england and massive changes are being made across the world now to support the BAME community. Its the right thing to do and the only way forward. "It's always been that way" or anything similar is just a pathetic excuse.

For those trying to make jokes of the subject, shame on you.
Bdill93 why don’t you start a trend and give up your membership to your golf club for one of the BAME community as you obviously see golf as a totally racist sport where only white privileged Males are allowed to play. I’m a member of a “ nice” golf club. I work very hard for a living and have never been given anything. I don’t want special treatment from anyone. I was brought up on a council estate in Peckham, south London and yes I have seen racism from both sides. To have BLM agenda thrown about for the most stupid reasons ( changing the name of the masters ) good god ,what on this earth is that going to achieve. The one word in your message that sticks out is PAST .augusta cannot rewind time.
 

Sports_Fanatic

Assistant Pro
Joined
Apr 18, 2012
Messages
472
Bdill93 why don’t you start a trend and give up your membership to your golf club for one of the BAME community as you obviously see golf as a totally racist sport where only white privileged Males are allowed to play. I’m a member of a “ nice” golf club. I work very hard for a living and have never been given anything. I don’t want special treatment from anyone. I was brought up on a council estate in Peckham, south London and yes I have seen racism from both sides. To have BLM agenda thrown about for the most stupid reasons ( changing the name of the masters ) good god ,what on this earth is that going to achieve. The one word in your message that sticks out is PAST .augusta cannot rewind time.
It's just an opinion from Bdill93; no need to get wound up about if if you differ on a proposed name change.

Looking at a Golf England study, 0.6% of the BAME community play golf so the percentage is really low. Interesting your assumption is that it's a lack of money (and perceived lack of effort to earn more from mentioning hard working) that is causing the restrictions. The study suggests that usual barriers to entry are present around cost and time, but actually they talk about environment, perception and stereotypes are very much a factor with people either not growing up/understanding the game or wondering if they feel welcome if they do show an interest - presumably a chance to take note of historical issues makes a clear impression that the BAME community are welcome and so those smaller changes (doesn't have to be Masters name change) could be more impactful than just insisting Bdill93 gives up his membership as they want "special treatment". Be interesting to see if clubs decide they should take a more active role to increase memberships and become more diverse - I think Sweden and Germany are often talked about as having a different golf culture, not necessarily on race but more family orientated around mixed golf but I may be mistaken as that's just snippets on forums I've read. Sort of links back in to the magazine's article on how would you design golf clubs now if starting from scratch.
 

Lazkir

Head Pro
Joined
Mar 3, 2016
Messages
692
It's just an opinion from Bdill93; no need to get wound up about if if you differ on a proposed name change.

Looking at a Golf England study, 0.6% of the BAME community play golf so the percentage is really low. Interesting your assumption is that it's a lack of money (and perceived lack of effort to earn more from mentioning hard working) that is causing the restrictions. The study suggests that usual barriers to entry are present around cost and time, but actually they talk about environment, perception and stereotypes are very much a factor with people either not growing up/understanding the game or wondering if they feel welcome if they do show an interest - presumably a chance to take note of historical issues makes a clear impression that the BAME community are welcome and so those smaller changes (doesn't have to be Masters name change) could be more impactful than just insisting Bdill93 gives up his membership as they want "special treatment". Be interesting to see if clubs decide they should take a more active role to increase memberships and become more diverse - I think Sweden and Germany are often talked about as having a different golf culture, not necessarily on race but more family orientated around mixed golf but I may be mistaken as that's just snippets on forums I've read. Sort of links back in to the magazine's article on how would you design golf clubs now if starting from scratch.

Have you got a link to that study?
 

Sports_Fanatic

Assistant Pro
Joined
Apr 18, 2012
Messages
472
Have you got a link to that study?
https://www.englandgolf.org/wp-cont...ic-Diversity-Through-Community-Engagement.pdf

This is more the material for golf clubs from the looks of it and relies on both Sports England studies and particular projects including one in Birmingham. It's a bit wishy-washy in a lot of places but generally is the obvious stuff of don't ignore typical barriers to entry like cost which still applies, but that you also have further barriers that you need to think about to attract participants.
 

Lazkir

Head Pro
Joined
Mar 3, 2016
Messages
692
https://www.englandgolf.org/wp-cont...ic-Diversity-Through-Community-Engagement.pdf

This is more the material for golf clubs from the looks of it and relies on both Sports England studies and particular projects including one in Birmingham. It's a bit wishy-washy in a lot of places but generally is the obvious stuff of don't ignore typical barriers to entry like cost which still applies, but that you also have further barriers that you need to think about to attract participants.

Cheers :)
 

drive4show

Ryder Cup Winner
Joined
Jul 16, 2011
Messages
13,127
Location
Poole, Dorset
Ethnic groups playing golf,interesting debate. I don't really understand why more don't. In the 12 years I have been at my club there has been 1 Asian guy and a couple of weeks ago I saw a black guy in the group in front of me. I don't know if he is a new member or was a guest. One thing I do know is that everyone is made to feel welcome at my club so if any ethnic people joined they would they would be included in all club activities. The husband of the woman that runs our bar and catering side of things is black, he also works in our halfway hut at weekends. He is universally liked, really nice guy. Having said that, Dorset doesn't have a very high ethnic population compared to other parts of the country.
 

HomerJSimpson

Hall of Famer
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Messages
64,692
Location
Bracknell - Berkshire
A genuine question, perhaps to those from ethnic backgrounds, but does the stigma of golf clubs and the stereotype of the 70's and 80's put people off even now. We do have members from Asian backgrounds but not from any other part of the BAME spectrum, certainly not any black members. Bracknell is a large and diverse town close by but I wonder if the "Royal" in the name puts people off (maybe we're back to the lines of master/servant from other parts of the thread even subconsciously) or they feel they wouldn't be accepted or stand out.
 

Bazzatron

Q-School Graduate
Joined
May 12, 2012
Messages
1,617
Location
Oldbury, west mids
A genuine question, perhaps to those from ethnic backgrounds, but does the stigma of golf clubs and the stereotype of the 70's and 80's put people off even now. We do have members from Asian backgrounds but not from any other part of the BAME spectrum, certainly not any black members. Bracknell is a large and diverse town close by but I wonder if the "Royal" in the name puts people off (maybe we're back to the lines of master/servant from other parts of the thread even subconsciously) or they feel they wouldn't be accepted or stand out.
I was born in '83 so can't comment on the 70s or 80s but the word Royal wouldn't put me off anything.
 

sunshine

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Messages
1,071
Ethnic groups playing golf,interesting debate. I don't really understand why more don't. In the 12 years I have been at my club there has been 1 Asian guy and a couple of weeks ago I saw a black guy in the group in front of me. I don't know if he is a new member or was a guest. One thing I do know is that everyone is made to feel welcome at my club so if any ethnic people joined they would they would be included in all club activities. The husband of the woman that runs our bar and catering side of things is black, he also works in our halfway hut at weekends. He is universally liked, really nice guy. Having said that, Dorset doesn't have a very high ethnic population compared to other parts of the country.
Rightly or wrongly, private golf clubs have a reputation for being elitist and snobby, the last bastion of chauvinism, sexism, racism. The media portrayal of golf often plays up to these stereotypes.

Golf clubs are intimidating places to strangers. There have been loads of threads on here from new members worried about making a faux pas in their first round / comp / visit. When you arrive at a golf club you're faced with signs everywhere telling you about what you can't do: no changing shoes in the car park, no mobile phones, committee only, members only... and that's just the car park! And then you have the dress code.

If a person thinks the golf club isn't going to welcome them then they won't go there. In reality, your golf club may be incredibly welcoming to ethnic minorities, but if the club isn't pro-actively doing anything to dispel the negative perception it's not going to go away. And if you have a full membership there is no burning platform to attract new members from different backgrounds.

My perception is that public courses have a more diverse mix of ethnicities because they are less intimidating places. I'm thinking about the courses that @Orikoru and @Traminator play at: they are next door to each other. The public course Haste Hill has a much more diverse membership, and this includes affluent Asian people who could easily afford to play at Northwood next door but wouldn't join it because it was a bit snobby they think it's full of racists. It may have changed now, but 15 years ago there were no ethnic minorities at Northwood. There was a documentary about the club, which is about the most cringe-worthy thing that's ever been on tv...

https://www.channel4.com/programmes/the-club/on-demand/19016-001
 

Traminator

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 6, 2020
Messages
1,954
. It may have changed now, but 15 years ago there were no ethnic minorities at Northwood.
It has indeed changed massively. The general population around here has a very obvious high percentage of people of Asian descent and this is clearly obvious on any given day on the course.

The membership is very diverse, the Chairman is of Asian descent actually.

The days of the documentary are long gone, I believe most of the board had to resign so I'm told.

Most of the membership that I have mixed with are very much working people, the down to earth approach starts at the top with the manager who is a very friendly Scottish ex Royal Navy CPO.

Happy to report there is absolutely nothing snobbish whatsoever. 👍
 

sunshine

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Messages
1,071
It has indeed changed massively. The general population around here has a very obvious high percentage of people of Asian descent and this is clearly obvious on any given day on the course.

The membership is very diverse, the Chairman is of Asian descent actually.

The days of the documentary are long gone, I believe most of the board had to resign so I'm told.

Most of the membership that I have mixed with are very much working people, the down to earth approach starts at the top with the manager who is a very friendly Scottish ex Royal Navy CPO.

Happy to report there is absolutely nothing snobbish whatsoever. 👍
That is great news.

As little as 12 years ago it was quite different. High Asian population in the area, but not Northwood.

I hoped you've watched the documentary, it is hilarious and tragic at the same time.
 

murphthemog

Grand Slam Winner
Joined
Mar 9, 2007
Messages
23,833
It has indeed changed massively. The general population around here has a very obvious high percentage of people of Asian descent and this is clearly obvious on any given day on the course.

The membership is very diverse, the Chairman is of Asian descent actually.

The days of the documentary are long gone, I believe most of the board had to resign so I'm told.

Most of the membership that I have mixed with are very much working people, the down to earth approach starts at the top with the manager who is a very friendly Scottish ex Royal Navy CPO.

Happy to report there is absolutely nothing snobbish whatsoever. 👍
Have they fixed the car bresk ins in the car park? Not played Northwood for ages, but it used to be notorious for getting your clubs stolen from your car.
Similar to the Buckingham.
 

Traminator

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 6, 2020
Messages
1,954
Have they fixed the car bresk ins in the car park? Not played Northwood for ages, but it used to be notorious for getting your clubs stolen from your car.
Similar to the Buckingham.
Not heard anyone mention that. There's a pin code on the sliding gate to get out.
 

Traminator

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 6, 2020
Messages
1,954
That is great news.

As little as 12 years ago it was quite different. High Asian population in the area, but not Northwood.

I hoped you've watched the documentary, it is hilarious and tragic at the same time.
I certainly did watch it in my research of somewhere to join.
I did what I did with the other place I was considering, just turned up at the front door, spoke to the manager and had a look round.
It really is a very welcoming and well-run club from what I've seen so far.
 
Top