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  1. #11
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    Sure. Playing the provisional would be playing a wrong ball and he'd lose the hole in match play or add two strokes in stroke play and must still correct the error.

  2. #12
    Tour Rookie Dasit's Avatar
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    if it goes 5 minutes and you dont find initial ball

    then walk to provisional to play, and spot the first ball in that time.


    Is the provisional ball the one you play?
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  3. #13
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    Quote Originally Posted by rulie View Post
    Sure. Playing the provisional would be playing a wrong ball and he'd lose the hole in match play or add two strokes in stroke play and must still correct the error.
    Then let me try another direction - lets assume the player returns to his original position and hits another shot please explain precisely how the score has now changed because of this needless consumption of time? - especially when we're moaning about slow play?

  4. #14
    Money List Winner paddyk's Avatar
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    Quote Originally Posted by drdel View Post
    Then let me try another direction - lets assume the player returns to his original position and hits another shot please explain precisely how the score has now changed because of this needless consumption of time? - especially when we're moaning about slow play?
    because there are more options than just stroke and distance..

  5. #15
    Ryder Cup Winner FairwayDodger's Avatar
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    Quote Originally Posted by drdel View Post
    Then let me try another direction - lets assume the player returns to his original position and hits another shot please explain precisely how the score has now changed because of this needless consumption of time? - especially when we're moaning about slow play?
    A ball is only unplayable if the player says it is. So a bad lie with a cracking provisional 50 yards further down the fairway - I'll hit the provisional, thanks. A bad lie with a crappy duffed provisional 50 yards shorter in the rough? I'll try and hit the first one thanks.

    The rule is that you can't use the provisional once the original is found and that is absolutely right.
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  6. #16
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    Quote Originally Posted by paddyk View Post
    because there are more options than just stroke and distance..
    Quite. But I'm just interested on how the experts score the original position.

    Let's say the provisional is played under 27.2 a. ball is found but player declares it unplayable. There's three options , The option to replay from original spot (penalty 1). Under 27.2 c he can be playing the wrong ball - 2shot or loss of hole. However the R&As note on rule 27.2 says...
    "Note: If a player plays a provisional ball under Rule 27-2a, the strokes made after this Rule has been invoked with a provisional ball
    subsequently abandoned under Rule 27-2c and penalties incurred solely by playing that ball are disregarded."

    Thus the common "stroke and distance" with a 1 shot penalty both seems common sense and time efficient! But I may be deluded!

  7. #17
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    Saving time doesn't trump all the Rules. The point has already been made that a player should not have a choice of which of two balls to play. If you don't want to find the original, don't look for it, just carry on playing the provisional (and that saves more time than looking for the original).

  8. #18
    Tour Winner Maninblack4612's Avatar
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    Quote Originally Posted by drdel View Post
    Then let me try another direction - lets assume the player returns to his original position and hits another shot please explain precisely how the score has now changed because of this needless consumption of time? - especially when we're moaning about slow play?
    The player's decision as to whether the original ball is unplayable should not be influenced by where the provisional is, that's not fair. If this was allowed & the provisional ball was well down the middle, past where the player could expect to get his "unplayable" ball in 3 shots, the choice is easy. If the provisional finished in a worse place than the original, he'd choose a different kind of relief. In equity, he shouldn't have the choice, at the time of declaring the ball unplayable he shouldn't know where the replayed shot is going to finish up.

    The provisional for a lost ball rule is actually not perfect in as much as the player can choose not to look for a ball if he's played a good shot with his provisional. This is a choice he shouldn't really have but that's the rule, which is designed to speed up play.
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  9. #19
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    So you're both saying the "Note" from the R&A on rule 27.2 means now't ! But that's wrong because that's exactly what it is there for.

  10. #20
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    Re: Ball unplayable - play provisional instead?

    Quote Originally Posted by drdel View Post
    So you're both saying the "Note" from the R&A on rule 27.2 means now't ! But that's wrong because that's exactly what it is there for.
    You'll have to identify which "Note" you're referring to. Regardless, it will not permit using a provisional ball, played because the original may be lost or may be out of bounds, as a ball under any of the options of Rule 28. If you were to choose option a under Rule 28, you must return to the previous spot and play from there; you are not permitted to use the provisional once the original ball has been found (which has been pointed out many times already).
    Last edited by rulie; 10-Feb-2018 at 20:13.

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