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  1. #21
    Major Champion SwingsitlikeHogan's Avatar
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    At a bit of a tangent - I am actually not that worried about damaging an iron - they are simply the 'tools of the trade'. If one is a bit scraped or has a nick taken out of it - well that's a bit of bad luck and a disappointment - but I don't worry myself over it and so am not that overly protective of my clubs. If a bit of damage won't make any difference to how the club plays then just so be it. That said - I don't go around deliberately doing things that might cause damage if I have an option to avoid doing so.
    to infinity and beyond...

    ...well from 10.0 to 9.4 this year would be nice.

    And with just the October medal to go - I've got to 8.3

    Job done

  2. #22
    Challenge Tour Pro mikejohnchapman's Avatar
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    Quote Originally Posted by atticusfinch View Post
    The rule does not say "light" it says loose. The tiger stone was heavy but it was not solidly embedded...it was sitting flat on the ground. The fans provided enough muscle to easily move the stone.
    This was the incident I referred to earlier.

    I thought they changed the rules after this but maybe they just clarified them. As I recall it took a while for a group of spectators to move the loose impediment. Not good for pace of play!

    The boulder had been placed there as part of the design - it had not rolled there by accident.

    So to take it to an extreme - could you get a greenkeeper to move a boulder with his tractor or a 4X4 to drag it away providing it was loose?

    How could he tell it was loose - no single person could move the boulder it took a group of men to shift it?

    If Brandon Grace reads this he will get a JCB to follow him around just in case.
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  3. #23
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikejohnchapman View Post
    I thought they changed the rules after this but maybe they just clarified them.
    No. They simply explained that the decision had been around for 40 years.

    As I recall it took a while for a group of spectators to move the loose impediment. Not good for pace of play!
    As it happens, Woods was having to wait for a problem up ahead. No time was lost.

    The boulder had been placed there as part of the design - it had not rolled there by accident.
    Loose Impediments don't have to have arrived by accident. They just are what they are, where they are.

    So to take it to an extreme - could you get a greenkeeper to move a boulder with his tractor or a 4X4 to drag it away providing it was loose?
    Yes, providing it didn't cause undue delay

    How could he tell it was loose - no single person could move the boulder it took a group of men to shift it?
    Its weight or difficulty in moving is not the test. The criterion is being solidly embedded.
    It could be seen that the bottom was resting on the ground.

  4. #24
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    [QUOTE=rulefan;1756429]
    Quote Originally Posted by jim8flog View Post
    Tiger Woods is famous for doing this after a ref declare the stone was not a loose impediment because it was partially embedded.


    The ref did no such thing. Woods was allowed to move it because it was a loose impediment and was not embedded.
    A decision dated some 40 years before confirmed his action

    You are quoting the wrong incident. I am referring to the one where Woods left the embedded rock (about the size of 3 golf balls ) in place and hit the rock then the ball.

  5. #25
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    Quote Originally Posted by atticusfinch View Post
    You got it backwards jim. The ref agreed with woods it was a LI.
    You are not referring to the same incident.

  6. #26
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    Originally Posted by mikejohnchapman
    They stopped that afterwards by saying the impediment had to be easily moveable.

    Quote Originally Posted by jim8flog View Post
    You are not referring to the same incident.
    Is this the incident ?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4lVCF8c5zk
    Last edited by rulefan; 12-Oct-2017 at 16:46.

  7. #27
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    Quote Originally Posted by jim8flog View Post
    You are not referring to the same incident.
    I see the relevance of your post to the initial post. I got lost in the digressions.

  8. #28
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    The boulder had been placed there as part of the design - it had not rolled there by accident. of L The rule does not distinguish between those types of LIs.

    So to take it to an extreme - could you get a greenkeeper to move a boulder with his tractor or a 4X4 to drag it away providing it was loose? Yes, as long as it did not unduly delay play.

    How could he tell it was loose - no single person could move the boulder it took a group of men to shift it?daylight If you see the tape, the boulder had "daylight" showing under it. If it had been embedded there would be no space under it. Again, it required several people to move it because it was heavy, not because it was embedded.

  9. #29
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    Quote Originally Posted by rulefan View Post
    No. They simply explained that the decision had been around for 40 years.



    As it happens, Woods was having to wait for a problem up ahead. No time was lost.


    Loose Impediments don't have to have arrived by accident. They just are what they are, where they are.



    Yes, providing it didn't cause undue delay



    Its weight or difficulty in moving is not the test. The criterion is being solidly embedded.
    It could be seen that the bottom was resting on the ground.
    There was some debate over this as I remember.
    as some said a lesser player with no gallery would not be able to move the Boulder.

    I don't think in the spirit of the game you should be able to enlist the crowd or a JCB to improve your line of shot.

    In the forth coming changes to the rules I think it should read.

    If a player and his caddy can't move said obstruction themselves then it's not a moveable obstruction.

    Getting the crowd to do it is not fair to the other players IMO.

    But that's another story.

  10. #30
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    Re: Must I strike the ball first?

    Are we talking about loose impediments or obstructions? This is why people get lost in these discussions because they change in mid stream, or seem to.

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