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  1. #21
    Challenge Tour Pro Jates12's Avatar
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    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    Quote Originally Posted by paddyk View Post
    it's not easy though. a while back a pp holed out from the fairway and as we approached the green he walked on and picked up his ball which rather than drop fully in to the cup was just jammed between flag and the hole.

    what would you have done?
    As you stated he had holed out so therefore he must of, you cant argue with that because that's what you wrote on the forum and there is no evidence either way.
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  2. #22
    Ryder Cup Winner pauldj42's Avatar
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    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    Quote Originally Posted by Orikoru View Post
    Well what is the rule? If I saw my ball like that I probably would have nudged the flag so the ball can drop in and then picked it up (just instinctively speaking) - would I be right or wrong there??
    Not exact wording, for the ball to be deemed "holed out" the whole circumference of the ball must be below the lip of the hole, if when removing the flag the ball drops, it is deemed "holed out" if it stays embedded in side of hole and above lip the ball is removed and placed on side of hole and tapped in.

    Someone else can probably give you the actual rule and correct words.

    Paddy's mate would of been in breech of the rules if the whole ball was not below the lip when he picked it out, it doesn't have to be sitting in the bottom of the cup though.

  3. #23

    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    Quote Originally Posted by Orikoru View Post
    I have a mate like that. But since we only play friendly games we just let him crack on. In a friendly match you're only cheating yourself so I don't see the point? Personally I want a true reflection of what my score is at the end, no point lying to yourself.
    Yeah I agree, when we're just having a friendly game we just let him crack on and find it amusing. That occasion though it was part of a tournament we'd organised between ourselves. We were all playing to win, so I wasn't going to let him get away with it!

  4. #24

    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    The one thing I cannot agree with is "they're only cheating themselves". No they are not, they are cheating everyone else.

    Yes there is a difference between inadvertent rule breaking and cheating and most golfers can tell the difference on the spot.

    I caught our former captain cheating in last year's Captain's Day when he found his ball after at least 12 minutes looking whilst the rest of the group had finished out on the green. He then bullied a junior into signing the card with his score on that hole. We dealt with him.

  5. #25
    Money List Winner paddyk's Avatar
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    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    Quote Originally Posted by Pathetic Shark View Post
    The one thing I cannot agree with is "they're only cheating themselves". No they are not, they are cheating everyone else.

    Yes there is a difference between inadvertent rule breaking and cheating and most golfers can tell the difference on the spot.

    I caught our former captain cheating in last year's Captain's Day when he found his ball after at least 12 minutes looking whilst the rest of the group had finished out on the green. He then bullied a junior into signing the card with his score on that hole. We dealt with him.
    I've only seen full out cheating a couple of times . it makes you wonder how much does go on though.

  6. #26
    Head Pro LincolnShep's Avatar
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    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    I've seen inadvertent rule-breaking but never cheating. I hope I don't see it, at least not perpetrated by someone that I like...

  7. #27
    Major Champion Foxholer's Avatar
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    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    Quote Originally Posted by paddyk View Post
    it's not easy though. a while back a pp holed out from the fairway and as we approached the green he walked on and picked up his ball which rather than drop fully in to the cup was just jammed between flag and the hole.

    what would you have done?
    Er...! If he 'holed out', then there's nothing more to say!

    If you state that Tashy's '5 minutes' was unequivocal, then the same reasoning has to apply to your post!

    Did he' hole out' or didn't he?!!

    As for what i'd do if it hadn't been 'holed out' but was merely resting against the flagstick....As we approached the green, I'd make sure (s)he knew that if the whole ball was not below the level of the hole, then (s)he hadn't holed out yet and would have to make sure that the ball was allowed to drop fully (or sufficiently)! I've actually been in that situation a few times - once where a partner holed out from the fairway, once where a FC had a 'hole in 3' and once where a fellow committee member's other half failed to hole out properly, so was consequently DQ-ed. The excellent (winning!) score for the round was, however, counted for handicap - though that hole was deemed 'blobbed'!

    If I was certain that the ball hadn't fallen below the required level and the FC had picked the ball out, I'd simply state...Unfortunately, the Rules require... If I wasn't quick enough to observe one way or the other, I'd ask the FC (and accept their reply) whether the whole ball was below the level of the hole, explaining the difference between each state. Like so many other conditions, the onus would then be on them as to whether to 'cheat' or not! That way, my conscience (about being fair to the rest of the field) would be clear and the likelihood of any bad feeling resulting would be minimised!
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  8. #28
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    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    I once caught one(call him C) of the opposite pairs cheating(pairs matchplay, just a social game for a few pounds iirc), and had to pull C on it. We were playing the 13th and they were beating me/partner by 5 holes, so basically we had lost. But he moved his ball on the sly away from trees so he could hit it, iirc P had lost his ball and then C didn't call a penalty on himself for the 'free' drop)

    I spoke to his partner(call him P) that we had lost the game but why did he need to cheat like that as we were being killed out there by them. I just saw red and couldn't stop myself saying something and said by peace. To say it was awkward for the remaining holes is an understatement with a number of crossed words.

    It was so awkward in fact that he didn't even have a drink with us or travel back with us...and I had driven three of us there(just me and P travelled back as C refused to get into the car). I never played golf with C again and we use to play probably half a dozen times a year. Wont like to see that happen again.

  9. #29
    Major Champion Foxholer's Avatar
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    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    Quote Originally Posted by Yant View Post
    ...
    Building a stance is one i always see people doing when they are trying to play out of the thick stuff.
    'building a stance' is nowhere as common as 'improving the lie' - and the Pro game is apparently not without a few potential candidates for this rule-break (which in their case IS cheating!). The instances I refer to are where a ball is in thick-ish rough and a wood or hybrid is initially selected to play the shot; after a couple of downward presses, the lie suddenly gets to a state where either the shot is a lot easier, or a more desirable club can be used!
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  10. #30
    Money List Winner paddyk's Avatar
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    Re: Cheating/rule breaking

    Quote Originally Posted by Foxholer View Post
    'building a stance' is nowhere as common as 'improving the lie' - and the Pro game is apparently not without a few potential candidates for this rule-break (which in their case IS cheating!). The instances I refer to are where a ball is in thick-ish rough and a wood or hybrid is initially selected to play the shot; after a couple of downward presses, the lie suddenly gets to a state where either the shot is a lot easier, or a more desirable club can be used!
    neat trick . never thought of that before.

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