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Thread: Article 50

  1. #9531
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    Re: Article 50

    Quote Originally Posted by maxfli65 View Post
    If the plot/argument was so decided why are we really so little further on than 20 months ago?
    Reality biting.
    My post was expressing a personal opinion on SILH's statement/comment on his MP's response- not the Brexit general debate!

  2. #9532
    Ryder Cup Winner Hobbit's Avatar
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    Re: Article 50

    Quote Originally Posted by drdel View Post
    I think this lump of rhetoric demonstrates the plot/argument has been well and truly lost
    Worst case of denial I've ever, ever seen. The vote was a binary choice. The majority of those that voted, voted out. As a committed Remainer, I don't like the result but I absolutely knew what was being voted for, including out of the single market and customs union. Both sides in the run up to the debate made it very plain what the result of out would lead to.

    Everyone that fighting that result is using more spin and twist than I've ever seen in politics. All this argument that democracy demands a vote on the terms is just rollocks. Enact the vote, that's democracy. Don't enact the vote... that would just be the establishment ignoring the result of the vote.

    As for the hard line the EU is taking. They buckled before Christmas more than I ever thought possible. They are desperate for a big lump of money and some sort of control over one of the leading economies in the world. Personally, although I voted Remain, I'd be telling them to get stuffed, and walking away.
    Give it big humpties

  3. #9533
    Journeyman Pro maxfli65's Avatar
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    Re: Article 50

    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbit View Post
    Worst case of denial I've ever, ever seen. The vote was a binary choice. The majority of those that voted, voted out. As a committed Remainer, I don't like the result but I absolutely knew what was being voted for, including out of the single market and customs union. Both sides in the run up to the debate made it very plain what the result of out would lead to.

    Everyone that fighting that result is using more spin and twist than I've ever seen in politics. All this argument that democracy demands a vote on the terms is just rollocks. Enact the vote, that's democracy. Don't enact the vote... that would just be the establishment ignoring the result of the vote.

    As for the hard line the EU is taking. They buckled before Christmas more than I ever thought possible. They are desperate for a big lump of money and some sort of control over one of the leading economies in the world. Personally, although I voted Remain, I'd be telling them to get stuffed, and walking away.
    I agree with that, I dont like it either but I understood a leave vote meant a total exit from EU.

    2 concerns I have are firstly it's just a shame we don't have at least another one of the bigger 28 member states doing the same as us, we just seem very isolated without more support for what we're doing (or trying to do) and secondly it would have been so much easier if there was consensus from the whole UK and it's 4 component parts on leave/remain rather than being split 2/2 in countries and 52/48%. 65% across the board and we'd be motoring by now. A Union needs consensus to be an effective Union despite the disparity in size of different parts of that Union.

  4. #9534
    Major Champion Foxholer's Avatar
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    Re: Article 50

    Quote Originally Posted by SwingsitlikeHogan View Post
    My MPs response to my question on Brexit in pointing out that his constituency was very pro-Remain - and his turning from a Remainer to a Leaver since the vote - was to ignore my question. Instead he stated that the government was implementing the will of the British People and that delivering on that vote was more important than any economic issues leaving might result in.
    I believe he was absolutely correct! And that's actually all the referendum was about - not the details of what deal etc.

    It's now the Government's job to ensure that the 'best deal' for the UK can be achieved!

    I'd actually like to see more 'cross-party' involvement in the negotiations, though appreciate that that could easily turn into a(n even greater) shambles! I don't believe 'Parliament' should have the 'final say' on the agreement! I'd sooner that deal was put to another referendum, though, again, appreciate that could well cause major problems if the 'wrong' result happens!
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  5. #9535
    Major Champion SwingsitlikeHogan's Avatar
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    Re: Article 50

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Skier View Post
    Do you deliberately lie just to spice up a thread.
    What are you talking about. I may make mistakes in understanding what i have read or understood I DO NOT LIE.

    Withdraw please or I shall raise a complaint with mods - I have much tolerance of rubbish thrown my way - being told that I lie I do not accept.
    to infinity and beyond...

    ...well from 10.0 to 9.4 this year would be nice.

    And with just the October medal to go - I've got to 8.3

    Job done

  6. #9536
    Major Champion SwingsitlikeHogan's Avatar
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    Re: Article 50

    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbit View Post
    We're going round and round in circles. Dominic Lawson , nor the rest of the population know what we will be transitioning to till its been agreed. We know what both sides want, that's been made pretty clear.
    Dominic Lawson is VERY pro-Brexit. My reading of his piece in yesterday's ST was that he is getting VERY impatient with May and the current state of the government's position and lack of clarity in respect of what we want to achieve out of the negotiations. That said I think he is a firm advocate of 'All Out Now'
    to infinity and beyond...

    ...well from 10.0 to 9.4 this year would be nice.

    And with just the October medal to go - I've got to 8.3

    Job done

  7. #9537
    Major Champion SwingsitlikeHogan's Avatar
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    Re: Article 50

    Quote Originally Posted by drdel View Post
    I think this lump of rhetoric demonstrates the plot/argument has been well and truly lost
    Yup - Brexiteers are all facts - no assertion - no rhetoric
    to infinity and beyond...

    ...well from 10.0 to 9.4 this year would be nice.

    And with just the October medal to go - I've got to 8.3

    Job done

  8. #9538
    Major Champion SwingsitlikeHogan's Avatar
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    Re: Article 50

    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbit View Post
    Worst case of denial I've ever, ever seen. The vote was a binary choice. The majority of those that voted, voted out. As a committed Remainer, I don't like the result but I absolutely knew what was being voted for, including out of the single market and customs union. Both sides in the run up to the debate made it very plain what the result of out would lead to.

    Everyone that fighting that result is using more spin and twist than I've ever seen in politics. All this argument that democracy demands a vote on the terms is just rollocks. Enact the vote, that's democracy. Don't enact the vote... that would just be the establishment ignoring the result of the vote.

    As for the hard line the EU is taking. They buckled before Christmas more than I ever thought possible. They are desperate for a big lump of money and some sort of control over one of the leading economies in the world. Personally, although I voted Remain, I'd be telling them to get stuffed, and walking away.
    That Remain in the form of Cameron, Osborne etc stated that leaving the EU implied leaving the CU and the SM is I suggest somewhat a red herring in respect of making the Brexit case. Because the Leave campaign said that that was all untrue - it was all Project Fear - it was a big lie - and I suggest that many Leave voters believed that Project Fear argument.

    Brexiteers cannot now turn around and say it was not Project Fear at all - that Cameron and Osborne were telling the truth -
    because in doing so they are admitting that it was Leave that was being disingenuous and deceitful in the run-up to the vote. After all such as Daniel Hannan stated very clearly that what Cameron and Osborne were saying was just Project Fear because he said the UK could stay in the SM after leaving the EU.
    to infinity and beyond...

    ...well from 10.0 to 9.4 this year would be nice.

    And with just the October medal to go - I've got to 8.3

    Job done

  9. #9539
    Money List Winner Old Skier's Avatar
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    Re: Article 50

    Quote Originally Posted by SwingsitlikeHogan View Post
    What are you talking about. I may make mistakes in understanding what i have read or understood I DO NOT LIE.

    Withdraw please or I shall raise a complaint with mods - I have much tolerance of rubbish thrown my way - being told that I lie I do not accept.
    Seems that it's ok for you to throw rubbish but you get all touchie feelie when you are found out.

    You publish why you deliberately misquoted me and I will accept your mistake.

  10. #9540
    Money List Winner Lord Tyrion's Avatar
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    Re: Article 50

    I'm hoping these speeches genuinely give some direction to what the gov't want. I'm very fed up with the vague phrases that TM keeps churning out. It is possible to put some meat on the bones without giving away your whole negotiating hand. At this point they actually need to stop dancing around anyway and start being straight. Time for ideas and a backbone.

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